CP,

I wouldn't give up on the idea of children just yet; if you recognize these behavioral problems, then you probably won't let your kids fall into the same patterns.

Scott~

You're right - parents ARE the main problem.  But what can be done???  Do most parents even care that their demon kids reflect negatively on them??? 

And yes, your children ARE very well behaved.  But don't most parents think that???  How many parents would admit to having evil children??? 

As I said in a couple of my posts, I DO realize that parents are mostly to blame for misbehaving children.  The majority of parents just do not care.  They let their children do whatever they want.  Parents who do nothing while their child is having a fit in public angers me just as much.  Sometimes I have to think though, "that child should know better."  The child playing on the window bar at the Buffalo airport must have been 7 or 8.  Certainly not an adult, but an 8 year old should know that kicking glass with their feet and 'playing monkey' when NOT at a playground is probably not a good idea.  However, if you saw this child's parents you might side with the child - I almost wanted to.
 
And you're right, I do not have any children so I can't possibly understand the challenges associated with them.  I mentioned that not all of them are evil.  I happen to know some that are very well behaved.  They would never act like that.  Why???  Their parents wouldn't let them. 

The fact is though, spoiled, misbehaved children have made me decide that I don't want any children on my own.  But I'll admit that I shouldn't have any.  There are numerous people in this world that should NOT have any children but they do anyways.  It takes a certain kind of person to be a good parent.

The more I re-read my post, the more angry I become with parents who don't discipline their children.  Too much work perhaps???  If you can't handle one child, why keep having more??? 

I've heard on numerous occassions that you need a license to drive a car, a permit to carry a gun, etc, but you don't need anything to have a child. A valid point.  There should be some kind of testing. 

How about this: Kids, like cars should be inspected once a year.  If they don't pass inspection (a behavior test included), it is illegal to take them places.  Why should everyone have to suffer???  Ever been to the movies and had a child start screaming during it???  I have.  Those parents paid half as much money as everyone else for that child to sit there and now they are ruining it for everyone in that theater.  Adults can't have cell phones on (for good reason).  Parents can't have their children set to "scream" mode.

Ironically, I always wanted children.  I babysat a lot in high school - loved kids.  It was only after college that I realized I no longer wanted them.  Perhaps I should spend more time with children that know how to behave. 

As I've said for the third time now, I know that parents are mostly to blame. What is a child taught in school though I wonder???  I believe even behaviors taught in school need to be reinforced at home.

And no, I do not approach these parents.  What do you suggest I say, "hi, obviously you have no idea that your child is causing a disturbance as you sit there and do nothing.  Please quiet your demon kid already." 

Oblivious "numb" parents are no excuse for poor behavior from their children. 

I'm sure most parents think that they're children are the brighest, cutest, sweetest little angels on Earth.  But people on the other side of the fence often have a different view. 

Sadly, parents must often bring their children with them to run errands, etc, even when the child missed their nap and is clearly not in a good mood.  And I do believe there is a difference between a grumpy child and one that is simply misbehaving.

Let me clarify that I see children a daily basis in a lot of different places and the majority of them ARE well behaved.  There are always those few who aren't though.  And that is what you remember. 

Maybe this thread should be changed to: "should just anyone become a parent?"  Think about it - how many children are actually PLANNED and WANTED?

And luckily for me, there are vacation resorts that are for "adults only".

This may be a bad example, I'm not sure, but it makes sense to me. It is, (I hope) an example on how certain (not all) people with children feel they should have special priviledges just because they have chosen to give birth.

I live on a street in the city of Lockport that happens to have a Middle School at one end. The speed limit is 30 MPH, as it is throughout the city. BUT when these parents are dropping off their precious little darlings off at school and picking them up in the afternoon, I may as well be living on the Autobahn(sic?) They whip up and down this street with no regard for anyone else, just their schedule, and God knows they always have the right of way. I have tried to move one car out of my driveway to get the other car out on occasion, and endured a barage of obscenities and gestures from these type-A nut job parents who think they are entitled to be incredibly rude because they have they are running late.                                              ---And who is sitting there, in the car, as they go 60 MPH down a residential street, and who is sitting there while the parents scream at total strangers just for trying to get out of their own driveway? The kids, that's who. And yes, it is the parents, but I agree with CP, in this case, I don't want to turn into one of those people. All I get out of this display is the grisly duty of cleaning up umpteen smushed dead squirrels because God forbid they should have to apply their brakes, when they have such momentum going. If you want to cross the street, you do it quickly and at your own risk around here.

I know my tolerance level when it comes to children, and it is quite low, but it is lower for these complete ignoramuses who apparently did not assess their own temperment before having children, and now are proceeding to take their bad judgement out on the rest of the world.

Obviously, this isn't a blanket statement, and I know there are great parents out there, but the parents who are bad, are infuriating. And I shudder to think what their children will grow up to be.  

RattyJenn wrote:

---

I know my tolerance level when it comes to children, and it is quite low, but it is lower for these complete ignoramuses who apparently did not assess their own temperment before having children, and now are proceeding to take their bad judgement out on the rest of the world.

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I couldn't have said it better!  :) 

And I totally agree: people with children think they deserve special privileges.  Example: a couple jobs ago, I had to work nights, weekends and holidays.  Okay, bad enough, but when it came time to give a couple people the day off, the ones who usually got granted the holiday off were the ones with kids.  "I have a family...", they'd say.  Wait, so, because I'm not married with kids I couldn't possibly want Christmas Day off???  I too come from a family. 

My favorite was when a co-worker wanted Halloween night off to, "spend with his 9-month old".  SHE HAS NO IDEA WHAT DAY IT IS!!!  She wouldn't even know if he wasn't there.  Why do parents think they deserve special privileges over anyone else???  I will never ask to leave work early to go to a parent-teacher conference, I will never call in sick because my child has a cold and had to stay home from work and I will never claim more on my taxes because I had a carpet monster.  Shouldn't deciding NOT to have children offer benefits?  (Actually, in my opinion, not having the kids IS the benefit). 

But now we're getting off-topic here... 

Hmmm...I am trying not to be defensive here...I respect your opinions but also I take offense to this ...You must understand that not every parent is like this?  Or do you just work with a bunch of schmucks?

  I am my childrens mom, my husbands wife and my parents child. 

  I work opposite shifts as my husband, & set up appointments around my work schedule (which by the way at my job...none of the single people do! ~ they make dentist appointments when they are scheduled to work! )

  .  No, I do not work holidays...BUT that is because I am high senority NOT because I have children.  My husband has a job that requires employees on round the clock watch 24 hours a day 7 days a week & 365....he misses many holidays and activities due to his work requirements etc.  Neither not ask for special priviledges from a single w/no child co-worker.

  We don't call into work because the kids are sick because we work opposite shifts.

  I was raised with the thought process of "You have kids~ you take care of them"  and "your childrens actions directly reflect back onto you and visa versa".

  I totally see what your saying...but it truly sounds cruel to hear you call children "carpet monsters" and such...

  I agree with you....it aggravates me to see "career women" poping out kids and having the "nanny" raise them...etc etc

  The bottom line here is parenting takes orginization, patience and comman sense among a thousand other things...not everyone is cut out for it.

  BUT Think about what if your parents felt the same way as you do about children....and never had you?

 

 

NYCOWIFE, I'm sure I can speak for CP when I say sincerely that it is not our intention to offend anyone. But, there are a certain part of society that really milks the parental thing. I am certainly not referring to you, and I'm sure CP is not either. I think, if anything, it is a very good thing to acknowledge, as an individual, that you (by you, I mean me) are very possibly not parental material. I mean in my particular case, I like to drink too much, curse like a trucker, and would probably have parental skills that would make Joan Crawford look like the Patron Saint of Children. I guess the point of this post is to express frustration at not the children, but the parents of the children who probably shouldn't be parents at all.

I do, however, feel that there is not enough discipline, or at least lack of follow through with a lot of parents. But, it is a different age, I guess...about a year ago in Tops, I witnessed a mom who was frustrated with her child grabbing everything in the store, smack the child's hand, after repeated verbal discipline. A woman, who this mother did not know from Adam, leaned over the freezer aisle, and said, "I saw that, and now I'm watching you." I thought that was ridiculous. And yet thirty years ago, when I was a child, no-one would bat an eyelash.

Times have changed, but I'm not convinced it's for the best.

Anyways, no offense was intended.

What a bunch of dicks. Just because your parents hit  you and you're into that sort of thang, why should all children be subjected to that sort of violence? My mother, a single parent, could discipline me better with a look, than any threat of violence.  

I never said a child should be beaten.  Nor was I for the record.  Slapped on the ass, yes, but nothing to cause bruising or bleeding.  I do not condone beating your kids.

My point was that parents have to lay down the law and I don't believe a little, "now, honey, don't do that," cuts it.  It certainly didn't for the children I've seen in public.  A majority of the parents I see are pussies.  Plain and simple.  They let their kids do whatever they want.  The kids walk all over them.  Getting away with small things leads to bigger things. 

If most parents were firmer with their children, you'd have a more behaved generation of children. 

Actions speak louder than words.

I think there is a big difference between slapping a smart mouthed child and beating them. When my kids act up in public we go home, end of story. Having said that I think I have gone home one time with each child. They know what is expected of them when we are out, but do need to be reminded of what is acceptable. At home we give them more space to be loud and unruly. Make no mistake, they are mouthy at times and misbehave because that's how kids are. Put them in a car together for more that 15 minutes and they fight like wild animals. I can't explain this strange syndrome, but am told that they are very polite well behaved children when they visit other peoples homes.